Viewing a thread - Hard Facing

cordellh

Posted 4/3/2014 23:22 (#3795740)
Subject: Hard Facing

Want more information on what is hardfacing? Feel free to contact us.

Hey guys - Anybody out there very good at hard facing/surfacing sweeps? We have been burning thru our heel sweeps that are really thin/cheap. Was going to try and hard face them but unsure of the best practice. The guys in ND that did our bean knives I know oxywelded them. Will a stick welder with rods work on thinner edges? How about this flux core wire thru my mig? Cost obviously matters too. What have you found to be the most economical? These particular heel sweeps are not available hardfaced or any thicker, but they sure work great on our chisel plow. Problem is they only last about 30 acres in our sand. Any thoughts appreciated!! Thanks!! BryceH

Posted 4/3/2014 23:29 (#3795745 - in reply to #3795740)
Subject: RE: Hard Facing

Nunn CO

Nunn CO

I have messed around with mig and stick hard facing. If its thin I would recommend .30 wire and go with the mig. Mig is much faster, and I personally have better luck with thin material. .30 is still enough that you can put on material but not to thick. I will say is pricey compared to regular wire though. hog987

Posted 4/4/2014 00:10 (#3795781 - in reply to #3795740)
Subject: RE: Hard Facing

Central Alberta

Central Alberta

One thing to watch out when doing any hard facing. The new weld will be hard and wear a lot longer. If you are just doing the leading edge this is where the problem comes in. The rest of the metal had been heated up and usually cooled slowly therefore making it softer. So once you wear through the leading edge than things will wear more quickly. You can try to keep the leading edge on but overtime the metal will get very brittle from being welded on many times. So than what needs to be done is some hardfacing on the whole thing to avoid this. A lot of the time it is more economical with ag parts to just replace them when worn than fiddle around with hard facing. Ben D, N CA

Posted 4/4/2014 00:15 (#3795786 - in reply to #3795740)
Subject: RE: Hard Facing

Whiskey, Tango, Foxtrot

Whiskey, Tango, Foxtrot

MIG welder is much faster, and I find it does a better job than stick. I always had problems with the stick, in order to get the rods to burn well and actually weld to the parent material, I had to use too much heat. You don't always want to actually 'weld' hardfacing in, esp on thin material like that. You just want to stick a bead onto it so it wears first. I've burned way to much stick hardfacing rod, but on heavy wear parts on crushers and loader buckets, dozer blades. It works fine on that, but I found MIG to be much easier to handle on thinner steel.

Flux core hardfacing wire is ironically, very soft. Sort of hard to feed. It is more expensive, but I much prefer using solid wire. Your buying all hard steel wire though, no flux. Have to weld mostly flat. Pull the bead instead of pushing the puddle.

Try different patterns and see what works the best. Some will wear better than others. Hard to know without seeing what your trying to hardface, but 45* patterns or X's usually work fine. illinois-kris

Posted 4/4/2014 06:59 (#3795958 - in reply to #3795740)
Subject: RE: Hard Facing

IL

I just run standard mig wire (ER70s-6) across to build up wear parts. After every layer I brush on old motor oil with a paint brush. I'll do one layer on one piece then move to the next and so on that way the original piece is cooled. I take the part outside (fumes and welding = boom) and wash the oil residue off before the next pass with whatever I have handy; paint thinner, naptha, carb cleaner, brake cleaner, gasoline, parts washing fluid.... This process has worked well for me on the ripper and chisel plow but I'm also in silt loam soil. boog

Posted 4/4/2014 08:05 (#3796096 - in reply to #3795740)
Subject: RE: Hard Facing

Personally, I prefer stick but that's what I grew up with. Your local welding supply house should be able to advise on which rod is the best to use. I leave the wire welder to my son Rawleigh

Posted 4/4/2014 08:15 (#3796130 - in reply to #3795958)
Subject: RE: Hard Facing

White Stone, Virginia

White Stone, Virginia

NO BRAKE CLEANER ON PARTS TO BE WELDED!! If any is left in a pocket, etc it will turn to phosgene gas (like used in WWI) when welded on and can kill you! I know you may be very careful to make sure it is dry, etc., but someone reading this might not know the danger.

Edited by Rawleigh 4/4/2014 08:16

man of steel

Posted 4/4/2014 08:38 (#3796202 - in reply to #3796130)
Subject: RE: Hard Facing

MI

MI

I believe that is just brake cleaner with chlorine in it

For more Hard Surfacing Mig Wireinformation, please contact us. We will provide professional answers.

MCatSHF

Posted 4/4/2014 08:55 (#3796261 - in reply to #3795740)
Subject: RE: Hard Facing

Sandy Hook, MB

Sandy Hook, MB

Hello Cordelln

When I hardsurfaced some cultivator sweeps with stick, I was burning through when I got to the very tip of the wing tips. I clamped a heavy piece of copper to the underside of the area being welded. It serves 2 purposes, it physically supports the molten material & also acts as a heat sink absorbing some of the excess heat as you work your way to the very tip of the thin material. It worked for me.

scott nelsen

Posted 4/4/2014 09:11 (#3796307 - in reply to #3796261)
Subject: RE: Hard Facing

Leeds, North Dakota

Mig welder with hard surface wire works well, it's time consuming, buy 3/8 shovels, and don't fiddle around, NO there not cheap, if ground is hard you will burn them up, something to try, if you have a mig welder with regular wire, weld along leading edge of sweep, install in wheel tracks and see how weld it holds up, think you will be surprised, Scott. skywalker

Posted 4/4/2014 09:54 (#3796394 - in reply to #3796307)
Subject: RE: Hard Facing

http://www.lincolnelectric.com/en-us/consumables/hardfacing/Pages/h...


The fastest most economical way would be with a stick welder. You will have to have the right gas mix along with set up to wire (MIG) weld it. For thinner material use a thinner rod. They make a verity of types of hard surfacing/hardfacing rods so it’s important to choose the right one. For longer lasting applications make sure it is on the side that takes the most abuse.
Ben D, N CA

Posted 4/4/2014 10:41 (#3796479 - in reply to #3796202)
Subject: RE: Hard Facing

Whiskey, Tango, Foxtrot

Whiskey, Tango, Foxtrot

Phosgene gas is very nasty stuff. I wouldn't fool around with any of it honestly. We've been using it for gopher and squirrel control, surprising how toxic even just a little bit of that gas is. I'm convinced now, no Brakeleen at all of stuff to be welded. Ether works just as well if not better, and after a few seconds it evaporates off enough it won't boom. pupdaddy12003

Posted 4/4/2014 10:58 (#3796499 - in reply to #3796394)
Subject: RE: Hard Facing

NW Central Ohio

NW Central Ohio

...I've always welded shovels or points on the "back" side of the leading edge. They will then wear to a sharp point. If you ever want to see if a bit of hardfacing will make a shovel last longer...just weld a 3/4" long bead underneath the point of an otherwise untouched shovel. Then put it next to another one without the added material. It's pretty dramatic, even on S-tine shovels or field cultivator shovels. Currently I weld the back side of some 4" straight points I have on a disc chisel. Biggest problem is having them wear so long, you wear off the material holding the shovel to the shank. Then the bolt head wears off and you end up losing a shovel. I've found I need to wear the one point of the shovel off, then when I turn them to use the other end...I have to weld over the bolt heads after they are installed. Don't do it with the bolts tight...or the heat will allow them to stretch. You install loosely, weld, let them cool then tighten.

Edited by pupdaddy12003 4/4/2014 11:33

jimgen

Posted 4/4/2014 18:04 (#3797181 - in reply to #3796499)
Subject: RE: Hard Facing

central mich

I know cryogenic hardening will extend loader cutting edges for loaders about 6 times for AS 400 steel. Local guy does farm implement teeth etc. also. Charges by the pound. coco

Posted 8/30/2015 14:07 (#4761080 - in reply to #3796499)
Subject: RE: Hard Facing

I just bought a salford wing plow came with new 4 in sweeps and 10 in wing would you hard surface the underside of these or do both sides I have never done this before but have heard everything last longer and to replace shovels and wings it's about a thousand dollars so that's why I'm asking I don't suppose anyone has a video on how to do it thsnks for any info

I'd keep it clean and dry so it doesn't RUST out, and see how it wears over a few years. Then you might go ahead and hardface it just for the fun of it anyway, but you'll know if you need to or not.

How many backhoe buckets have you worn out in the past? and how long until you expect to die?I'd keep it clean and dry so it doesn't RUST out, and see how it wears over a few years. Then you might go ahead and hardface it just for the fun of it anyway, but you'll know if you need to or not.

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